Lunch Time Lessons

Need help or advice? Ask any questions about the game and more experienced people will answer you. Improve yourself!
User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Valorious
Sergeant
 
Posts: 641
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:47 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Valorious - 330
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Valorious » Fri Jan 10, 2014 4:13 am

Beaue wrote:I've got a few.
I don't know everything about the game yet, as I'm fairly new. I have read up a bit on these forums to try to get as much knowledge as I can, though.

Without the passive devastator missiles item, how do you attack air units with melee or ground-only heroes like the Vulture? Protoss has disruption web, Zerg have scourges, are devastator missiles or yamato the only options for certain Terran units?

What are all the ways to detect stealth? So far I know of sensor towers/overlords/observers, Siege Tank scan, Raven's level 3 science vessels, creep towers, and level 3 builder towers. Then there are "temporary" revealers like Defiler's plague, Overlord's disease cloud, Infestor's fungal growth, and Ghost's EMP. Who else has abilities that reveal stealth? Also, am I missing any methods of detection?

I keep seeing references to maps like "Solar," "Temple," "Crypt," and seeing screenshots for maps I've never played. I've only seen River, Forest, Island, and Desert. Am I playing a different version of the game or are these old (retired) maps?


Other spells that reveal: muta echolocation, medic irridiate/blind, banshee suppression drones iirc, and preserver ice bolt. (I may have missed a couple but those quickly come to mind)

As far as dealing with air as t, dev missiles are so bad don't waste the item slot. I think the only use of them is to show who is new. Vulture can hit air with its jump, damage along the path of the jump and it will fire a shot while jumping. Heroes like fb can kill obs with their q. When it comes to dealing with flying heroes t has good anti air by its in the form of hero abilities rather than items. (Though yam can be helpful vs air in many situations) ground based aa abilities from thor/ares punish air hard and the vik rules the sky at higher levels. (It does struggle vs vr early/mid in most cases) If things get hairy as t vs air a good old ld/yam will usually force them to port out if you don't have a vik/pred/tank/fed rine/rauder with ult/thor/ares/medic with all its items. T has the tools imo, they are just different from the other races.

The other maps are from different map sets. River/forest are from the oldest map set but are among the favorites. (Especially river) The other maps will get rotated in from time to time.
Image
Art by Honey

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Jan 10, 2014 12:05 pm

Here we go. Things that reveal:
Zerg: Overseer Item, Broodling's Broodcell, Corruptor's Corruption, Defiler's Plague, Infestor's Fungal, Mutalisk's Echolocation Active, Overlord's Disease Cloud, Lurker's Ensnare, Drone's Level 3 (?) Spore cannon

Protoss: Observer Item, Dark Archon's Maelstrom, Probe's Beam, Preserver's Frost Bolt, Archon's Chain Lightning, Sentry's Fork Lightning (if you can get it to jump to the cloaked unit), Probe's Level 3 cannon (?)

Terran: Sensor Tower Item, Raven Level 3 Science Vessels, Banshee's Suppression drones, Medic's Blind, Medic's Irridate (gotta have vision for the first second to target them with this), Siege Tank Scan, Ghost EMP, SCV's Level 3 turrets (?)

It's been ages since I've played a builder, but I think those are correct. I think that is all of the ways to detect in this game though. Hence why peoples perception of ghost being amazing, is, well.... just wrong.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Fri Jan 10, 2014 5:33 pm

Yeah, ghost is definitely not my fav. Not just because of stealth, but because of the long cook time on nuke. I prefer firebat's ult over ghost's. I'm still trying to find a favorite Protoss hero, and right now I'm really liking Dark Templar, but the last game I played, zerg kept dropping about 7-10 overlords per lane, and they were spread far enough apart that I would have had to use disruption web quite a few times to get them myself. I really have only played Pubs, so I can't always rely on teammates to kill them for me. Any suggestions on the best way for a DT to kill flying detection?

Here are the methods I can think of, maybe I missed some:
-Disruption web (semi-slow going, depending on placement. Have to wait on CD)
-Nova (is that even worth the energy cost for a DT to waste on detection?)
-Interceptor (never bought this item, read that it's not worth it)

Thanks for the responses, btw.

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Jan 10, 2014 5:37 pm

soul channel is really your only other option. DT in pubs can suck for this reason.

Another strategy is to swap them into the lane so your creep kill them along their path.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Germiahish
Captain
 
Posts: 1071
Joined: Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:56 am
Race: Protoss
Battlenet ID: Germiahish
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Germiahish » Fri Jan 10, 2014 5:40 pm

Yes nova is worth it, especially versus Zerg because Zerg creep is easy to kill. As DT your only income is through waves cleared with energy nova and through hero kills. As for over seers, use soul drain or swap them into your wave

-- Fri Jan 10, 2014 12:40 pm --

Too slow lol
Fus 3.0
Some wrote:This was definitely NOT Germ's fault
Germ actually did play well tbh
Germ's a solid player
Germ is better than me now

Most wrote: l2p
Germ is bad
Germ is Fus

Artrek wrote: BANNED

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEZJnyzG4jc

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Fri Jan 10, 2014 6:02 pm

Ahhh, I didn't think about soul drain or swap! Excellent! Thanks guys!

-- Fri Jan 10, 2014 11:12 am --

Oh! Here's one:
Is there any way to target your own hero with a spell without clicking on him? Say for things like Dmatrix or transfusion.

Example: when I play defiler, and pushing, it's hard to target the defiler hero in the middle of a huge pack of creep while zoomed out, so if I'm low on health and need to use the transfusion item to heal, can I just hit my hotkey for transfusion and another hotkey for the hero (ie: F3) or do I have to click the hero?

Any other suggestions for targetting those hard-to-click heroes (ie: Reaper)?

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Jan 10, 2014 6:21 pm

No you cannot use a hotkey to target a hero. As for the hard to click heroes, all I can suggest is keep clicking :P It'll come with practice.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Fri Jan 10, 2014 7:07 pm

Hmm, ok. What about queuing commands. Recommended or no?
Example - Reaper:
-hit "T"
-click air unit
-while running towards air unit to execute command, hold shift
-right click (a click) air unit you want to focus (so your hero doesn't see a squirrel and get distracted)
-hit E
-release shift

My question: Is it a good idea to queue commands in this way, or are there delays between commands when you queue them?
Also, will the reaper automatically attack the target you jump on, or can he attack any air neighbors after the jump? I'm wondering if the a-click step is necessary. I'd just test it myself but I'm at work.

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Jan 10, 2014 7:19 pm

I believe it works pretty well. I don't use it personally, but I know Splash uses it when swap/stunning with DT and he is one of the best DT's I know if not the best. I'd say try this out at some point and see if it works for you.

Reaper will automatically attack after it jumps the target. I wouldn't know how the que command would work with beserk in this scenario though.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Fri Jan 10, 2014 8:20 pm

I know the Reaper auto-attacks after it jumps, but say there are 3 air units next to eachother, does the reaper only attack the target it jumped on, or can it hit all 3 from one jump? That's what I meant to ask.

I know the jump doesn't last very long, and doesn't cost energy (iirc) so I can just re-cast it if I'm killing creeps. However, say there are flying creeps near a flying hero and I jump on the hero. Will the reaper auto-attack the hero, or is there a chance I'll attach the creeps?

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Jan 10, 2014 9:15 pm

I'm 80% sure it attacks the unit you originally targeted.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Splash
Sergeant
 
Posts: 594
Articles: 1
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:16 am
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Splash
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Splash » Fri Jan 10, 2014 10:09 pm

I believe when reaper jumps on an air unit it will autoattack the nearest hostile air unit. So 9/10 it will attack the unit you targetted with the jump, unless it was an observer or something and there was another enemy air unit in range, or if the targetted unit moves away and there is now a closer target.

Once you're in the air you can attack any air unit in range. If there are 3 air creep you want to kill, you can jump on the first one, then manually attack the other two, and then finish off the first creep. Keep in mind that you will fall to the ground if you either kill the unit you jumped on, or if they moved a certain distance away from you.

@shift-queuing:
I'm not sure if it'll work in that case, because I believe reaper's berserk cancels previous commands and just searches for the nearest target.

I do use shift commands for lots of other things though. As dark said, it's nice to get a smooth swap/stun, and I also use it for running right after blinking/pouncing etc. I think it's especially useful if you play with higher latency. I have about 200 ms ping playing on the NA server, so the time you save between clicking the target and the command actually going through is quite significant. I'd recommend trying it out, you might find it useful.
Image
AI OP!
honey wrote:Shortie is Fus.

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Nubbins
Developer
 
Posts: 3317
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:56 pm
Battlenet ID: Nubbins.218
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Nubbins » Fri Jan 10, 2014 10:17 pm

shift-queuing reaper berserk works.
Puru Puru Pururin~

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:27 pm

Any advice on winning a builder vs builder battle over farms in pubs - without relying on teammate support, because it's a pub?
Example: Probe and Queen keep fighting over crit farms. Assuming they are on equal footing skill-wise, is this an auto-win for queen or does probe have a chance of taking the farms and keeping them?

The reason I ask is that half the time I play Probe I find myself fighting over farms for half the game. I generally don't go with builders for other races because I have other heroes I prefer, but for Toss, Probe is my new fav. When going against a queen, the larvae are enough to help queen easily take down probe towers, but other than mothership, I don't see an easy way for probe to take down queen towers and larvae early to mid game. And isn't it kind of silly to use mothership for crit farms when you could be hitting zerg towers or base with it?

Lastly, are builders still banned IH?

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Mon Jan 20, 2014 8:54 pm

So fighting vs a queen for farm control is not the easiest thing for probe. A couple tricks you could try are building a pylon or two in range of the spore cannon to tank some of its damage (try to salvage it before it dies so you don't give unnecessary feed). Then build a cannon in range of the spore cannon. This should allow you to get your cannon up and along with soul channel/probe's beam you should be able to overtake it. If this is difficult though, it is more worthwhile to spend your time farming creep waves to get a stat advantage over the queen. Then overtaking the farm will be easier. Also, Take the farms that are easy and close to your base. You shouldn't need to worry about fighting over them too much. If the queen is using his hero to overtake those, you can usually outlevel him in lane during this time making it easier to take them back.

Yes it is silly to use MS for crit farms unless you are on river and all three spores are together and you can take all of them down.

Yes builders are still banned IH.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Mon Jan 20, 2014 9:01 pm

Good to know! I just remembered another question I had awhile back:

Bunkers. It says in the tooltip that you can command units to go inside the bunker (can't remember exact syntax). I thought this meant that you could buy bunkers and have AI units enter it, but I couldn't find a way to do this. Can bunkers only hold heroes?
Last edited by Beaue on Mon Jan 20, 2014 9:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Mon Jan 20, 2014 9:03 pm

hmmm. I don't have an answer to this since this was changed a little while ago. You used to be able to just click load and then select the unit and it would head there. People got to trolling though and started loading ally heroes to mess with their move commands. A.I. units may have been affected when this mechanic was prevented.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Mon Jan 20, 2014 9:19 pm

That makes sense.

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Germiahish
Captain
 
Posts: 1071
Joined: Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:56 am
Race: Protoss
Battlenet ID: Germiahish
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Germiahish » Tue Jan 21, 2014 5:11 am

You can only load your own hero or other units you "own"
Fus 3.0
Some wrote:This was definitely NOT Germ's fault
Germ actually did play well tbh
Germ's a solid player
Germ is better than me now

Most wrote: l2p
Germ is bad
Germ is Fus

Artrek wrote: BANNED

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEZJnyzG4jc

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Thu Jan 23, 2014 3:04 am

Generally speaking, when is the best time to stop crittering? Do you base it on what level you are, the time/wave, or what?

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Splash
Sergeant
 
Posts: 594
Articles: 1
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:16 am
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Splash
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Splash » Thu Jan 23, 2014 4:34 am

The most standard times to stop crittering is at the 5, 10, or sometimes 15 minute marks. These are when the next tier creep spawn and laning starts to give better exp and minerals than crittering. If your hero can't clear critters on its own, you usually stop at the 5 minute mark. If you can clear 2 patches, people generally go til 10 minutes. For 3 patches it's usually 10 minutes as well unless the lanes are doing really well. My personal preference for clearing 2 patches depending on your hero is once you reach a key level (level 5 or 7 usually) you stop crittering. That's usually around 8 minutes or 11 minutes.
Image
AI OP!
honey wrote:Shortie is Fus.

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Thu Jan 23, 2014 12:36 pm

^ dat
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Germiahish
Captain
 
Posts: 1071
Joined: Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:56 am
Race: Protoss
Battlenet ID: Germiahish
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Germiahish » Thu Jan 23, 2014 4:48 pm

Firebat, ultralisk, archon can take all 3 small crits on every map(I've tested it). They can take them as soon as you get a speed item. This gives you 90 exp so you can crit until your team needs you(usually at 10:30~15)
Fus 3.0
Some wrote:This was definitely NOT Germ's fault
Germ actually did play well tbh
Germ's a solid player
Germ is better than me now

Most wrote: l2p
Germ is bad
Germ is Fus

Artrek wrote: BANNED

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEZJnyzG4jc

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Thu Jan 23, 2014 8:03 pm

Ok, I keep seeing the following format in the guides section:

5 / 3 / 1 Attack / armor / energy

Does this imply that after you have 5 attack, 3 armor, 1 energy and all your item slots filled, that you spend the rest of your minerals on statups?

Btw, I appreciate all the responses. :)

PreviousNext

Return to Ask a Pro

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron