Lunch Time Lessons

Need help or advice? Ask any questions about the game and more experienced people will answer you. Improve yourself!
User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Thu Nov 14, 2013 1:55 pm

I usually have some free time around Lunch 12:00-1:00pm EST (and more time on slow days, which today might be). If you have any questions regarding any kind of strategy (IH or Pub), including hero advice, counter hero advice, teamwork/teamfight advice, build advice, map specific advice or anything really, feel free to post it here and I would be happy to help.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

TrippyColorz
Recruit
 
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Sep 08, 2013 1:05 pm
Location: HONLULU, HAWAII
Race: Protoss
Battlenet ID: trippycolorz

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby TrippyColorz » Thu Nov 14, 2013 8:11 pm

Hello, I have a few questions that might have been answered already.
- why is Hydras ult slowed when passing through HT ult bubble?
- why is HT health and speed so low from the get go?
- why is it so hard to chain spells as the HT?
- Does the hydras ult affect a unit after revival takes place,(thor, ultra, Immortal)
- whats the xp range,radius?
- How does xp range work on nutral critters, does everyone get xp in the radius or isit the team who killed it?

[Defy] Tydon
Captain
 
Posts: 1420
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 3:04 am
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: 953
Clan: Defy

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Tydon » Thu Nov 14, 2013 8:31 pm

Since this is mainly Darks thread, and he's probably at work atm, I can answer one or two of your questions. I just finished a match as HT going 18-3(67% leaver hurts)

1. Why is Hydra's ultimate slowed when passing through HT Temporal Rift? The Temporal Rift slows the timescale of everything that passes through it. Think of timescale as time itself. When timescale is reduced, everything in that bubble moves and happens at a slower pace. At level 7, the Temporal Rift slows everything down by 60%, and at lvl 14, it is increased to 75%. Timescale applies to everything. This goes from channeling spells, projectiles and movement speed. The Hydra's ultimate is a projectile in this sense, so it would slow down its' movement speed by 60/75%.

an even better example is this: When you hear the Yamato cannon spell being charged up, and you can see the initiator, if you're quick enough and plop a Temporal Rift onto that enemy unit, it'll now take that Yamato 60/75% longer to channel, and finally be unleashed.

2. Why is HT health and speed so low from the get go? Balance suggestions are always looked into on an individual and whole-scale level. The HT received a minor speed buff in the past increasing it from 2.25 to 2.62? or 2.5. Some have said that it would be even better for it to have a solid 3 movement speed, but that would need to be addressed in the balance threads.

3. Why is it so hard to chain spells as the HT? It's not so difficult. The first few times you play it, you'll have to grow accustom to how the spells work, their respective cooldowns and the length of time they are applied for. If you read over the abilities tooltips, you'll see that one of the HT abilities is Phase Shift, and it lasts for 4/6/8 seconds, which is halved on heroic units. Another, the Psionic Storm, lasts in the area for 4 seconds.

So, as a recent HT player myself, it's better to throw down your lvl 7 and 14 ultimate, the Temporal Rift(Bubble). Now, as I said before, this would lower the enemy units timescale by 60/75%. This makes everything much EASIER. Proper placement is crucial, however. Once the Temporal Rift has been applied, immediately channel your Phase Shift on the enemy hero. Why? Because Phase Shift slows their movement speed by an additional 50%, and makes them take even more spell damage. So Temporal Rift, THEN Phase shift. Afterwards, it's good to follow up with your Feedback Spell, Soul Channel, and Psionic storm. If you want that in an order, it's best to activate Psionic Storm, Feedback, and Soul Channel in that order.

Once late game hits, it's better for you to obtain the Stasis Field item, for 800 minerals. This is an item that takes the units caught within the AoE radius out of combat. They cannot take or receive damage. This is crucial to your survival, being as squishy of a hero that you are. Also, it can make for a new opening spell for trying to take down someone fast. If you plop your Stasis first, you can then properly aim your Temporal Rift, giving you the maximum efficiency that you need to chain your remaining spells.
Image

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Thu Nov 14, 2013 8:46 pm

Thanks tydon.

To finish up:
XP range is 10 I believe, but is increased for tank (might be another hero as well), since his attack range is over 10.

As for critters, only the team that gets the last hit on the critter gets the xp.

-- Thu Nov 14, 2013 2:51 pm --

went a little crazy with the colors though huh?
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
alboix56
Corporal
 
Posts: 346
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2013 11:50 am
Battlenet ID: alboix

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby alboix56 » Thu Nov 14, 2013 9:28 pm

I'm wondering if that range 10 exp is measuring diameter instead of radius, since I only seem to acquire exp from a radius that is less than 10 on heroes that do not have range increases; Just need some clarification on if "XP range" measures diameter or radius.
Yiffeh wrote:Fus Theory clearly states that for every action, there is an equal and opposite fusaction of badness proportional to the action.

It also clearly states that in a closed system, the badness will invariably increase until everything is Fus and String.

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Nov 15, 2013 4:49 pm

I'll check with Goeland or someone on teamspeak tonight. It might be 8 radius and also includes units you kill (say you use cruise missile or vr charge or any ability). Will get back to you.

-- Thu Nov 14, 2013 4:41 pm --

Checked with Goeland. XP radius is 10.

-- Fri Nov 15, 2013 10:49 am --

Almost lunch time, any questions?
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
akuma
Developer
 
Posts: 4088
Articles: 1
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:58 am
Battlenet ID: 510

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby akuma » Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:18 pm

o i only read the op but i have one for you your a dz solo mid on des and your vs a tank and a vik
1-how you not lose your lane/towers to that puch
2-how do you get in close to make a kill (don't say blink ill kill you)
3-how do you get income / exp to stay on par or ahead of them

this should be a good one to see pan out

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Nov 15, 2013 6:44 pm

akuma wrote:o i only read the op but i have one for you your a dz solo mid on des and your vs a tank and a vik
1-how you not lose your lane/towers to that puch
2-how do you get in close to make a kill (don't say blink ill kill you)
3-how do you get income / exp to stay on par or ahead of them

this should be a good one to see pan out


mk. well this is a teamwork game so you are already at quite a disadvantage early game. Given that dz is also a melee hero vs 2 range units your capabilities will be extremely limited. As for not losing the lane and losing towers, there isn't much you can do. The tank can push and will push. What you can do: See how ballsy each hero is being, if either one starts taking a lot of damage from creep waves, then soul channel and soul drain that hero. If they stay long enough, you can attempt to go for a kill. If the Siege tank is the one taking damage, save your blink for an escape out since the Viking will most likely use assault/cherry bomb on you. If the Viking is taking damage and he is low enough to 1 shot, you will most likely need to blink in on top of him and then hope you can run away before the tank kills you. General soul channel/soul drain rule, don't use this as a lead in if the hero is low. Wait until you have dived for him and taken some damage. This makes the most of the abilities. Another possibility would be to go up by the xel-naga tower and blink down from there for some surprise factor. If you are a dz soloing middle though, your main focus is to get to level 7. You will outlevel them easily and your main goal is to stay alive. Abuse soul drain and soul channel and warp prism. Try to time it that when your out of energy, your warp prism cd is done and you must be quick enough to get back to the lane after porting once the next creep wave is coming. Also, if the tank is focusing you instead of the creep wave. Endure some of the attacks and heal up with soul drain/soul channel so you can stay in range of the experience. If they are denying you extremely hard, try to sneak across the bridge and steal a critter from the other side of the map. If the tank and Viking are smart, they won't attack the creep wave though and this will not be worthwhile.

Summary:

1. Essentially, you will not be able to keep your lane until level 7.

2. Poke with soul drain soul channel to force them to port or suffer the consequences.

3. Income isn't quite so essential for DZ since you can farm up once your level 7 and your ultimate and the extra levels you've gained from soloing middle will put you ahead of them.

-- Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:01 pm --

Well. I guess if you wanted, you could also get in close by getting a level of counter and hoping that it bounces you to one of the heroes, but that's risky and luck based. Don't know if I'd suggest it.

-- Fri Nov 15, 2013 1:56 pm --

You could also try a test to see how quickly you run out of energy when trying to use a level of shadow clones to tank the wave when it gets to your cannons, but to be honest tank is going to shred through your cannons from range anyway so it wouldn't help much.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Splash
Sergeant
 
Posts: 594
Articles: 1
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:16 am
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Splash
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Splash » Fri Nov 15, 2013 11:19 pm

This lane will push to you so you'll get ~3/4 of the exp even if you just hug your towers. So, you can use the time in between waves to invade their critters through the bridge and make the critterer miss a few patches. Once the laners realize what you're doing, they'll ideally hold fire to make the lane not push as much. By that time you're probably around level 4/5 and have sufficient sustain to last in lane as long as you're not tanking all the siege tank shots. Also, one trick you can do if you have a solo lane DZ is ask if you can use one of your team's critterers' warp prism, so you can grab soul channel with your first 200 instead of a prism. This makes laning much easier since you'll have that extra sustain and damage.

1. You'll probably lose your towers early but exp>towers

2. Against good players you won't be able to make a kill in that lane

3. See above paragraph
Image
AI OP!
honey wrote:Shortie is Fus.

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Wed Dec 04, 2013 3:49 pm

I'm bored.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

[Gentlemen's City] swamp_
Corporal
 
Posts: 258
Joined: Sat Jun 15, 2013 4:53 am
Battlenet ID: Private
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby swamp_ » Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:30 pm

write a guide on how to kill people with karaks and utility bots

Image
hero karak! and a special guest appearance by Corwin!

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Thu Dec 05, 2013 12:55 am

Troll
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Germiahish
Captain
 
Posts: 1071
Joined: Tue Jul 02, 2013 4:56 am
Race: Protoss
Battlenet ID: Germiahish
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Germiahish » Thu Dec 05, 2013 5:54 pm

Hostile so op
Fus 3.0
Some wrote:This was definitely NOT Germ's fault
Germ actually did play well tbh
Germ's a solid player
Germ is better than me now

Most wrote: l2p
Germ is bad
Germ is Fus

Artrek wrote: BANNED

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEZJnyzG4jc

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:39 pm

By the way swamp, I went critter infestor on river and surround a tank 3 times and a raven twice by the 10 minute mark. I just felt bad though.

-- December 6th, 2013, 9:40 am --

Still taking any questions on gameplay scenarios here by the way.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
Artrek
Colonel
 
Posts: 1553
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:16 pm
Race: Random

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Artrek » Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:20 pm

Dark you want to help me with my DT? I know you said I did good. But I want to be better as DT and I know I have lots of room for improvement. Also I would love to hear Splash on it because he is the best DT I have seen.
GodKingFonzy wrote:I've taken my ganks
And my share of rage
You brought me wins and fortune and everything that goes with it
I miss you all
But its been no bed of roses
No pubstomp
I consider it a honor to be one of the Baddies
And we aint gonna lose

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] l)arkangel
Ninja
 
Posts: 3575
Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:18 pm
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Darkangel
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby l)arkangel » Fri Dec 06, 2013 4:55 pm

Splash's guide gives a great description: http://ha3x.net/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=1975
Main points are: early game: last hit creeps. you have one of the highest damage attacks to start and should take advantage of that on ursa or vs creeps.
Mid Game: Find your DA or another stunner and get powerfield once you start pushing. If DA ports, hang around until he gets back to protect his army. He should also have powerfield to allow you to go get energy once he gets back.
Late Game: Focus on controlling teamfights with stasis/vortex.

Notes:
1. Others should be helping with observers since you do not have a high income.
2. An underleveled DT is not a huge cause for concern. You are there for your stuns. Don't stun a lot early game to the point that you port back a lot and take a while to get to level 7. As soon as teamfights start happening (12-15 minutes usually) you want to have vortex.
Check out the Official HA3X Youtube Channel:
http://www.youtube.com/user/HeroAttack3X

Guides:
Predator
Preserver
I aint got nothin left in my will, cept throw it all in the casket its mine still

User avatar
[Gentlemen's City] Splash
Sergeant
 
Posts: 594
Articles: 1
Joined: Thu Jan 17, 2013 2:16 am
Race: Random
Battlenet ID: Splash
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Splash » Sat Dec 07, 2013 12:27 am

It's hard to say what to work on when I haven't seen your DT. If you have a replay I could analyze it although I have exams soon so I might not have too much time for it.

Some general things to note:
1. You have a strong timing window at level 7 with level 2 energy (assuming you follow the build order in my guide). Your swap+stun+vortex combo costs 170 energy, meaning you can get a full combo off with just level 2 energy. An example would be to swap+stun an enemy DA and vortex his army. If you have a VR or DA with you that's an easy kill. If the enemy DA is good they could stun you before you stun them, but you'll at least get your swap off before they stun because it has a higher range. Your team could still probably kill the DA depending on their position although you might die to the army. Still 100% worth

2. In teamfights I save my stun for anyone who could potentially dive into the middle of our team (ie. DZ). I usually use stasis on the enemy support hero (DT, medic, lurker). These heroes have the potential to just outright win a teamfight on their own if played by a good player. So just stasis them and win the teamfight yourself cause you're DT. The BS range of stasis also helps a lot with this. Use vortex to zone anyone who does a lot of damage but requires a favorable position (ie. DA+army). For swap just play it by ear, I guess. You can use it to save a teammate or to secure a kill.

3. When trying to catch someone with swap+stun, you can use psitrous for a nice speed boost. Most people don't expect you to suddenly get a lot faster. Also, if you know you can kill someone if you just close enough, you can swap to a nearby creep to get in range for a stun. They usually won't expect you to cover that much ground so it can be a nice way to catch someone off guard.

4. Once I get to level 14 I usually try not to take much exp. 14 is basically your max level of effectiveness, and unless you're going for an assassin DT, the extra damage and health you get from level 20 isn't worth the extra time on your death timer.

Playing DT is largely just calculating and judging how much damage both teams can do. Eg. Enemy DA is out of energy? Vortex/stasis them, ping like crazy for your team to come and force a fight. Your ally DA just turned 7? Tell him to ult the enemy DA and his army so you can safely swap and kill him.

There's a lot of stuff to think about when playing DT, and most of that just comes from playing it a lot. It's basically just knowing when to use your spells and engage, which you'll learn as you keep playing it.
Image
AI OP!
honey wrote:Shortie is Fus.

[Gentlemen's City] swamp_
Corporal
 
Posts: 258
Joined: Sat Jun 15, 2013 4:53 am
Battlenet ID: Private
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby swamp_ » Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:57 am

In addition to all the great advice above, one thing I've found to be absolutely crucial to playing DT is that you need to initiate. It's easy to get stuck in that "dance" where the two teams are moving back and forth just out of each other's range, waiting for the opponent to do something. You cannot do this as dt; you need to be the first to throw the vortex or stasis on someone (usually whoever can stun/kill you the quickest) and then stun whoever else is left. If you let the other team initiate, they will target the dt (squishiest) and your team would have lost some absurdly powerful spells.

zeroozero/fish
Recruit
 
Posts: 10
Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:45 pm
Race: Protoss
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby zeroozero/fish » Sun Jan 05, 2014 7:33 pm

I don't really use infestor much. When I go through a nydus with my army, I always lose it. I think i'm doing something wrong; Is it because I'm putting the whole army into the nydus or what? :O
I'm also kind of confused with the new nydus worm and it's ult :O
Is it just me or does medic's no vision thing only work half of the time? :O

User avatar
GodKingFonzy
Ninja
 
Posts: 3866
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2013 6:08 pm
Location: BANSHEES BEDROOM
Race: Terran
Battlenet ID: KingGodFonzy-598

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby GodKingFonzy » Sun Jan 05, 2014 7:38 pm

Only have the infestor enter and exit. Dont have your army enter. When you unload the infestor the army will appear with it.

I am a bad medic and nydus so I dont play them.
put me in the same category as Fus, but never EVER, put me in the same category as corwin

[Gentlemen's City] swamp_
Corporal
 
Posts: 258
Joined: Sat Jun 15, 2013 4:53 am
Battlenet ID: Private
Clan: Gentlemen's City

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby swamp_ » Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:21 pm

Yes, like fonzy said, load only your infestor. If you accidentally load units in, unload them one by one at the same nydus you loaded them into, and do not load or unload your infestor until all of your army is unloaded.

It's just you. Medic's blind works all the time. If there are two heroes and you only blinded one of them, that team still has vision from the non-blinded hero. Same with creep and other units. Also, you can't blind detection or buildings; those will always provide vision.

Also what is up with all those goddamn emoticons...

User avatar
akuma
Developer
 
Posts: 4088
Articles: 1
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 5:58 am
Battlenet ID: 510

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby akuma » Sun Jan 05, 2014 11:23 pm

nydus worm just got properly fixed in the lastest patch thats almost ready to be public

User avatar
Benettonkkb
Recruit
 
Posts: 66
Joined: Thu Aug 22, 2013 4:32 pm
Race: Zerg
Battlenet ID: Black

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Benettonkkb » Tue Jan 07, 2014 11:55 pm

akuma wrote:nydus worm just got properly fixed in the lastest patch thats almost ready to be public


Still smiling.

Beaue
Recruit
 
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Jan 09, 2014 1:08 am
Battlenet ID: Private

Re: Lunch Time Lessons

Postby Beaue » Fri Jan 10, 2014 1:08 am

I've got a few.
I don't know everything about the game yet, as I'm fairly new. I have read up a bit on these forums to try to get as much knowledge as I can, though.

Without the passive devastator missiles item, how do you attack air units with melee or ground-only heroes like the Vulture? Protoss has disruption web, Zerg have scourges, are devastator missiles or yamato the only options for certain Terran units?

What are all the ways to detect stealth? So far I know of sensor towers/overlords/observers, Siege Tank scan, Raven's level 3 science vessels, creep towers, and level 3 builder towers. Then there are "temporary" revealers like Defiler's plague, Overlord's disease cloud, Infestor's fungal growth, and Ghost's EMP. Who else has abilities that reveal stealth? Also, am I missing any methods of detection?

I keep seeing references to maps like "Solar," "Temple," "Crypt," and seeing screenshots for maps I've never played. I've only seen River, Forest, Island, and Desert. Am I playing a different version of the game or are these old (retired) maps?

Next

Return to Ask a Pro

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron